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@ Sunday, 12. Jul, 2009 – 22:37:10
Why are we here? Fucked if i know.
I do know this though. No one has a higher purpose than anyone else. No pope, no religious person nor atheist.
Maybe we don't have a purpose. Perhaps that's better. It's certainly more relaxing.
A banana doesn't have a purpose if there's no one around to eat it.
I don't know what the hell that means though. Either way ...
... I don't care.
I'm all for surprises.
tylluanpenry
Davidives
I think your right in consideration to what one person considers higher than another, but i really think the concept of their being a purpose to our existence can only really be traced through ecological means. Like how they say if the bees died out so would we.
Maybe thats our purpose. Maybe we have the intelligence to try and keep the earth alive through scientific means in a way that animals and plants cant.
DominicGee
You're right. That doesn't negate the need for heirarchy though.
Who's more important, the shepherd of the sheep?
Davidives
Whats more important the shepherd, sheep or the man on the hill laughing at both of them?
DominicGee
The man on the hill is the least important, for sure. in fact he sounds like a cunt.
malakeas
Pro Each and every one of us has a purpose on this earth. That is why we are born. I have yet to find mine. x
jackiblogg
what is purpose? a bottle opener has a purpose but it isnt essential [you could use something else like a screwdriver or a hammer to get at the contents] Perhaps a person doesnt need to be of use! Are we in fact dispensable?
People just are! We have our moment who knows if we are the butterfly that produces the hurricane, does it matter? If we were meant to know Im sure we would.
I agree with your first part.
If we were meant to know Im sure we would.
Are we really always conscious of what we are meant to know ? even while it was lying there before we came to know .
Davidives
I think the idea of a "purpose" comes from religion as a means to suggest we aren't doing all that we should be.
Life is certainly hard enough for a lot of people without worrying about if we have lived it right or wrong.
As they say
"No one gets out alive"
Then we should be doing,what we should.
Simply having a purpose, we will be left only with the purpose.
When we don't know ourselves, what you say is sure to happen.
The last line is true & Well said.
Davidives
I definitely agree to that. I think we are just as dispensable as animals are however in terms of prolonging our existance (which everyone seems to want to do for some reason) we are needed.
Our place on the Earth always seems unnatural to me. Trees and animals just go on with life, but we feel the need to change it. For better or worse.
jackiblogg
I know what you mean, we seem a bit out of step not quite in tune or a bit unbalanced. Perhaps that IS our purpose, to draw attention to the unnaturalness to 'rock' the boat!
The Bible teaches that purpose comes from God and that our reason for being here is to bring Him glory through the fulfillment of that purpose. As organic matter divinely created with purpose, the banana provides nourishment. Even if it not eaten in its mature form, it still fulfills its purpose when it rots, providing food for other organic matter.
As created beings mankind derives his hope from his Creator through the purpose for which God intends. Without such hope, life can possess no lasting meaning. Purpose is eternal and begins at birth. At some point we realize this to be true, whether is while we are here on this planet, or face to face with God once we die.
A lot of folks however confuse God's purpose for His plan. Because our hope comes from our desire for purpose, people who confuse purpose and plan often find hope to be elusive. Bouncing from one identity to another human beings seek gratification in life through things that only bring temporal hope because their purpose keeps changing. This is not God's plan. God's plan is that we find purpose in all we do because that which we do brings Him glory and honor.
Face to face with god,once we die ?
What we can't see when alive, You believe people would see after they die.
How can my self centered or self fulfilling purposes, like self gratification can ever bring glory and honor to god?
Creativesilence asked: "How can my self centered or self fulfilling purposes, like self gratification can (sic) ever bring glory and honor to god?"
If you live your life according to the purpose for which God intends, how could your life not bring glory and honor to Him? If a man prayers to God and the Holy Spirit speaks to your soul and asks you to feed that man, does not God get the glory when the man says, "I praise God for you."
It is narrow and shallow thinking that limits human understanding of the ways God uses His creation to bring glory and honor unto Him. Do not think that just because the human finite mind does not understand all things that God does not exist or can not take pleasure in you and give your life purpose and meaning. The reality of God is not dependent upon your understanding of Him or your willingness to accept Him. For that reason He calls Himself the I AM. Read the Bible. It has a lot to say on this subject.
Respected Sir,
"Holy Spirit speaks to your soul" ?
Is it talking only to you and none of us?
Where is the soul anyway, in the books ?
"It is narrow and shallow thinking that limits human understanding"
I thought thinking is narrow and limits understanding.
"The reality of God is not dependent upon your understanding of Him or your willingness to accept Him".T
Does the reality of god depend on your understanding of him or a few individuals?
"the human finite mind does not understand all things that God does"
Then how do "you" understand? Did he give you a special
processor !!!!
"you live your life according to the purpose for which God intends" And what was that ?
Reading is one thing, memorizing is one thing and understanding is another.Don't refer me to some books,i already have too many. Please try to explain, analyze. and try to make sense of it all so that we all may benefit.
spiritbird
Pro After all the great religions have been preached and expounded, or have been rvealed by brilliant scholars, or have been written in fine books and embelished in fine language and finer covers, man--all man--is still confronted with The Great Mystery
Chief Luther Standing Bear Oglala Sioux
Don't worry about the purpose. Just be glad you are alive.
very true
CS: Thank you for asking these questions. I offer my apologise for using terms that may be unfamiliar to you. It is a bad habit Christians often practice. Please permit me to answer your questions and add some clarification to my comments.
"Holy Spirit speaks to your soul" ?
Is it talking only to you and none of us?
Where is the soul anyway, in the books ?
Christians believe in the duality of man – man has a soul and a body. The soul is the invisible, but yet spiritual, side of humanity. I will not get into the origin of the soul as it is a subject on which the Bible is mostly silent. The Bible does however tell us that the soul is eternal, and will live on long after the body is dead and rotted. I believe that when the Bible says man was created in God’s image (Genesis 1:26) it is referring to man being created as a spiritual being as God is a spiritual being. The term “image”, or “likeness” as some translation state, can best be understood in light of Plato’s Form Theory which posits that the highest form of reality is suggested by the invisible idea or form. However, unlike Plato the Bible takes this idea one step further and calls this invisible image a soul.
One of the hardest parts humanity to understand is the connection between the soul and the body. Here within this connection we will find terms like “spirit of man” or the “heart of man” in reference to a type of spiritual intuition. I do not pretend to fully understand the inner connectivity of these facets of humanity, but the fact that they exist can not be denied. In as much as I understand humanity, the connection between the physical body and the soul is the human mind where conscious choices are made based on that which the body wants and the human spirit or the heart of man desires.
The Bible teaches that the heart of man is evil (Matthew 15:19); it wants what it want and not what God wants. God seeks to save the soul (Hebrews 10:39), while the heart of man seeks to gratify his flesh . The heart of man can be changed, though. Psalm 37:4 says, “Delight yourself in the Lord and He will give you the desires of your heart. When it becomes more important to live for God than the gratification of our flesh, God will speak to your spirit, your heart (which is most likely a part of the soul) . Then your mind will comprehend what it is you must choose and your decision will be made not on what will lead you to death, but that which lead you to life (2 Corinthians 3:4-6).
"It is narrow and shallow thinking that limits human understanding"
I thought thinking is narrow and limits understanding.
While the Bible does teach that the ways and thoughts of God are far superior to those of man (Isaiah 5:8) it also teaches that God can be known (Exodus 6:7, Psalm 46:10, Matthew 7:7-11, John 10:14). This is not to say that God will tell us everything about Himself, but rather will reveal to us in His way all things that we need to know as it relates to His purpose and meaning for our lives (Ephesians 1:16-19).
"The reality of God is not dependent upon your understanding of Him or your willingness to accept Him".
Does the reality of god depend on your understanding of him or a few individuals?
"the human finite mind does not understand all things that God does"
Then how do "you" understand? Did he give you a special
processor !!!!
The reality of God depends on my willingness to let Him speak to me (Matthew 11:15). However, God is no fool and therefore does not play games with people (Galatians 6:7). Those who seek God will find Him (Matthew 6:33, 7:7) , but not outside the context which He presents Himself which is the Bible. If you humble yourself and leave out pride and arrogance, God will in fact speak to you (James 4:7-10).
"you live your life according to the purpose for which God intends" And what was that ?
God’s purpose for me is to glorify Him and honor Him with my life. I do this according to a divine plan that He lays out for me on a day by day basis. I say day by day because while I often know the direction in which I am headed, I do not know what each step of my life will hold (Proverbs 16:9). I trust God to show me each step of my life, whether it be writing a comment like this to those who ask, or showing love to my children. I try to live my life according to the Bible, because it promises me eternal life when I live not according to my desires, but according to God’s desires. Sometimes I get it right, and sometimes I let my own pride and arrogance get in the way and thus miss the mark. But as a Christian, my salvation in Jesus does not mean I have to be perfect. God’s grace is a second chance to get things right. So, I pick the pieces of my life and keep seeking to do what God has called me to do.
Reading is one thing, memorizing is one thing and understanding is another.Don't refer me to some books,i already have too many. Please try to explain, analyze. and try to make sense of it all so that we all may benefit.
I do hope that these answers benefit you. Anytime you have questions feel free to ask. Everything I have shared with my is out of my own understanding of the Bible and not according to some book. Thanks for asking.
I felt your comments are not clear and a bit misleaing in the first place.
And i had to ask it straight. And i'm very thankful for your insightful concern and clarification.
But the comments and the answers still do lack the full clarity,And i'm curious to know. But i believe and realize what you say are true to what you know.
-----
You have mentioned what the bible says.
"Holy Spirit speaks to your soul" ?
man was created in God’s image (Genesis 1:26) it is referring to man being created as a spiritual being as god is a spiritual being.
God is a spiritual being as the holy spirit is clear.
And from what was said there is no doubt that god cannot be two. Everyone and everything is created by the one god. And is accessible to everyone who seeks him equally devoid of what we may call ourselves. And how can we say one religion is right or wrong when all are pointing to the same god.
If holy spirit talks to your soul, than buddha too talks to your soul, and allah too talks to your soul, infact the one voice speaks to all, as they clearly mean the same enitity.Which is common to life as a whole. It is what is realizedd from enlightenement, that all spiritualists agree and call it as the ultimate reality or God or Spirit..
All enlightened ones spoke about the existence of the same spirit.
Isn't it the phenomenon of the existence of spirit, which is agreed by all spiritualists devoid of what religion one might belong to, that is the actual fact and not the different words that convey the same thing. Water is still water even if you call it by a different name.
When this is all so very clear. Why are religions engaged in using terminology that is not universal and that which belongs to a particular religion and making it all the more alien, when the fact of it is actually always unifying. And this inability of getting stuck in the terminology and not the actual phenomena or state that these scriptures convey, is resulting in division which creates many gods and misunderstanding which defies the very core reality of the one spirit, the core reality of what the enlightened ones have left.
And how is it that the core reality is second to the path (religions) that leads to it.
Why do we keep clinging to the scriptures and religion and not to the phenomenon.
Why don't we understand what they call water on the other side of the globe is the same as we are calling with a different name.. Instead of saying God is water, is h20 or whatever, or saying h20 is the only way to go and not water.
Is there buddhism before buddha or is there christianity before christ.
And yet they are enlightened. Which only means the possibility for enlightenment is en-grained in every being, and the scriptures and every religion elucidates the same.
Instead of realizing and experiencing the same,like the enlightened ones did, what is the point in hanging on to the same words, and belonging to a particular language, which is only mere intellectual understanding
once we start arguing, explaining and keep telling
what the enlightened ones have said and not realizing it. Verbal and intellectual knowledge of the spirit is not the spirit.
"Holy spirit speaks to your soul, and the soul is an abstract, how do you think we can ever bridge the gap if we don't face it.
What buddha or jesus really want is one to realize and be the very spiritual being that they are. And simply praising god is not what christ or the one god's paramount wish is .Its just fine, but its not the essential spiritual being that jesus or buddha is pointing to.
This is what i mean with reference to your first few paragraphs.And i'm fully open to any explanation that you would like to have, on what i say. I will elucidate my opinion on the rest of the comments made by both of us, if we can look into it, And gain as much clarity as possible, you're most welcome.
And i prefer no religion at the expense of the other, as they mean exactly the same thing to me. In itself i see it as one path to enlightenment,and there are many ways to the same destination.(if at all i can call this reality a destination).The reference to various gods and religions is for the explanatory purpose, of the context.
CS:
The Bible is a sacred book that documents the relationship between God and man. It is the sole authority of the Christian faith and contains all Truth as it relates to life and godliness.
Think for a moment about what that statement is saying. No other book from any other faith can provide for you the Truth that is contained in the Bible. As bold as that statement is, I make it with all cerainty. I have read and studied the texts of other religions and find that only the Bible speaks to the complete spiritual identity of man.
One of the claims contained in the Bible is that the Christian God is the only true God. Christians do not believe that Allah is God, nor do they believe in the enlightenment of Bhudda or any other religion. Truth does not come from any other source other than the God of the Bible who speaks to my spirit by way of His Spirit. Everything He says to me agrees with what is in the Bible.
One of the things He says is for me to have no other god than Him. I can worship anything, but only He can give life. This life is given because without it I would die. No, I do not speak of physical death, but rather of an eternal spiritual of the soul. My soul is eternally, but has the capacity to die as only a spiritual being can die – eternally. This happens because my relationship with God is not perfect. I have done things that separate me from God that the Bible calls sin. My sin condemns me. God is perfect, but I am not. Only if by His love God forgives me of my sin can my relationship with Him be restored.
But God does not just pass out forgiveness; He demands payment. Christians therefore believe that God sent His son, Jesus, to pay for our sins by dying in our place. We also believe, however, that although Jesus died for our sins, he also was rasied from the dead and that now his Spirit lives in those who believe in what he did for us.
I will be the first to admit that the propositions on which Christianity is built sound strange. God is presented as one God with three distinct identities – Father, Son, and Spirit. All three are God and are on in the same. I believe this to be true at many levels, the most basic smply being the fact that God can do whatever He wants and I don’t have to be able to figure it out in order for it to be so.
I believe Christianity is the one true religion if for no other reason than it makes sense. It says I am a created being. Let’s face it, things do evolve, but for me it takes a whole lot more faith to believe that I originated from a single-cell organism than it does to believe that I was fashioned by a Divine Creator.
And the whole sin idea makes sense to me too. The Bible teaches that I am a sinner. Being a sinner means that my human nature is to live my life apart from what God intends for me. Apart from God my identity, who I am want to be, is wrapped up in my own ideas, and my own plans. Within this self-absored identity Iam want people to affirm me and tell me how great I am. On a global scale this is the stuff that makes dictators and maniacal warlords who seek to destroy all who refuse to affirm their sinful identities.
On the other hand, if the God of the Bible is my God, then the desire of my heart is to please Him. As such, who I see myself as being is wrapped up in becoming a person whose life does not belong to me, but to my God. Although I have the right as a man to live my life as I please, I recognize that all that I am does not belong to me but to the One who made. He has given me His word, the Bible to teach me how to live.Living for God makes sense to me.
Do not let the terminology get in the way of understanding the basic principles of the Bible:
1. We are created beings (Genesis chapter 1- 2)
2. Long ago man separated himself from God by committing sin. The consequences of that sin have been passed down to you and me (Gensis chapter 3, Romans 3:23).
3. The consequence of that sin is death (Romans 6:23a)
4. God has sent his son, Jesus, to satisfy the punishment for our sin and in exchange gives us eternal life with Him (John 3:16-17).
5. If you confess that you are a sinner, and believe in your heart that Jesus died for your sins, and that Jesus rose from the dead and now wants to give you the life of His Spirit, then your soul will be saved (Romans 10:9-10).
. I am sinner who has asked Jesus to forgive me of my sins many years ago. Thirty three years later I am still learning what it means to be a Chrsitian. I read and study my Bible. It s not complicated. God speaks to my spirit and reveals to me the Truth. And to me it all makes sense.
If you would like to ask Jesus to save you from your sins as only He can, pray this simple prayer.
Jesus, I am a sinner.I believe that you died from my sins, and was raised from the dead so that I too might live. Please forgive me of my sins and come into my life. AMEN.
If you ever do decide to ask Jesus to be your Lord and Savior, let me know and I will be there for you all the way. If you have more questions, just drop me a line.
jollyweez
Yes. I was about to say the same.
Don't worry - just enjoy.
Life is beautiful.
Just hope that you get the Ace card,
and enjoy every minute.
WyrdSeeker
Pro Our purpose, I believe, is to live out our potential.
What I would love to know is why everyone seems to believe that we are at the center of our purpose? Isn't that idea selfish and narcissistic and ultimately destructive to the universe as a whole?
Without it, you have crossed the ocean of illusion,
h8rp3r
I don't believe one person has a higher purpose than another. We all have a purpose and it is up to us to recognise our full potential. I believe in Karma and that what goes around, comes around which is why I try not to be as selfish or as introspective as I am naturally inclined to be.
Referring to your 1s tline, What you believe may well be the only actual fact about it..
bugelugzaflyonthewall
Each of us have a function in this earth, if that is purpose then yes, we have a purpose. Each of us are placed on this earth to partake in the existance of living, we are only successfull if there are successors in out life, people to pick up where we left off.
It is amazing how many people become wound up in pursuit of purpose, and miss the vitality in life, and alienate all those around them in the process.
We all walk in and out of authority at all times, and although their must be levels of heirarchy in order for harmony of existance none of us are more significant than any other. Though there are those who have the power of influence over thousands, there are those who impact but a solitary individual we each have a place to be, a destiny to follow and live to lead.
paulinemom
I a new one amongst you set the 'cat among the pidgeons'
Each and everyone has a right to their opinions
I am Wicca and I hold a seperate belief
We all hold a purpose to this Earth for our (mother) gives us life...a life we should all hold dear.
It is our purpose to perpetuate this planet (not ourselves) for the future generations.
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A whole raft of considerations there.... what one person considers 'higher' another may not. And what is a purpose anyway? Is your idea of a purpose the same as mine?
And of course, even if we DO have a purpose, maybe we're not supposed to know about it...
Or maybe some do, and some don't...
Or some should and some shouldn't...
This thinking has made me hungry. Perhaps I should just eat the banana...